Advice for Novice and Expert CS Educators with Jackie Corricelli

In this interview with Jackie Corricelli, we discuss advice for novice and veteran CS educators, the potential for collaboration between industry and educators, designing for more inclusive CS education, volunteering for CS education organizations, and much more.

Welcome back to another episode of the
CSK8 podcast my name is Jared O'Leary in
this week's episode I'm interviewing
Jackie Khor celli in our discussion we
talked about some advice for both novice
and veteran si s educators Jackie has a
ton of excellent tips for everybody as
she is an award-winning educator
multiple awards actually we also discuss
a really interesting idea of the
potential for collaboration between
industry and educators so make sure you
listen to that section as well as some
design tips for more inclusive CS
education and a potential for
volunteering for various organizations
like the Computer Science Teachers
Association which Jackie and I are both
on different state chapter boards those
are just some of the main topics however
there are plenty more things that we
discussed throughout this episode as
always the show notes can be found in
the app that you're listening to the
song by clicking on a link or by
visiting Ghirardelli recom and there are
a ton of links in the show notes so for
example at the beginning Jackie mentions
a bunch of different ciphers that kids
are using in a cryptography class and so
I a link to all of those different
ciphers so you can learn more about each
one of them and with all that being said
we're now going to start with an
introduction by Jackie hi I'm Jackie
Shelley it's wonderful to virtually meet
all of you
I'm currently a teacher at Connard High
School in West Hartford Connecticut
I teach AP computer science principles
and a brand new course called
cryptography and cybersecurity that we
designed from scratch also I'm a member
of the computer science advisory board
for the state department of education
that's a voluntary group I'm the vice
president for the Connecticut Computer
Science Teachers Association
and I'm constantly working on all kinds
of other projects to just improve equity
and access to computer science for all
students an example is that that's going
on this year is I'm an equity fellow
computer science teachers association
and that'll be until July 2020 the
cryptography part really captured my
attention what's an example of a project
that kids would work on in that class
yeah so they range the big upcoming
project at the end of the current unit
is students are picking a classical
cryptographic algorithm that mattered to
them for example I would choose Mary
Queen of Scots cipher which was a
nomenclature cipher they could choose
the way the 14th I know a couple
students mentioned
the Civil War encryption algorithms then
they would create a computational
artifact similar in language to the APCs
principles exam where they use a
computational tool to tell a story about
that algorithm and teach the audience
about it so it can be fairly unplugged
meaning that it's really centered on
programming using the computer as a tool
the project's could also be really
focused on programming for the main part
of the course we're using Python as the
programming language and so throughout
the course students are encrypting using
the encryption algorithms to both
encrypt and decrypt and also to hack
different ciphers starting with the
Caesar cipher and then the affine and
symbols that I may be mispronouncing
affine the affine and simple
substitution cipher the Bayesian a right
up through public key encryption do you
happen to have a resource that you could
point to for people who want to learn
more about cryptography and whatnot
cracking codes with Python it's a book
by Al swag art was the main inspiration
for this course it's been just a
wonderful reference for me I would kind
of cite that book that's a really great
starting place if you're interested
awesome I'll link to that in the show
notes can you tell me the story of how
you got into computer science education
Oh totally yeah so I didn't take a
computer science course at least a true
computer science course in high school
or in college when I graduated from the
University of Connecticut I wasn't even
quite sure what what computer science
was I knew that programming was really
interesting to me but I'm not sure that
I knew the breadth of computer science
I'm certain I didn't I was hired to work
at Raytheon and it was a funny story I
was at a career fair and there was a
person who came happened to walk by the
Raytheon booth and said hey how would
you like to know how a fax machine works
I said that sounds cool and I started
asked a few more questions than that
that was sort of the start of an
interview and I ended up there for three
years as a systems engineer start a
software and transition to systems I
used C++ I learned some object-oriented
programming I my first job was working
networking so I was doing sitting at a
bunch of circuit boards sort of stacked
simulating a navy ship on one side of a
communication and then a navy ship on
another side of a communication and we
were
signals from one Navy ship to the other
and seeing if those signals were
received correctly or not so that was my
first job
everything was in hex I had never heard
of hexadecimal digits and all of the
programming was done in C++ and so on
the job training with engineers who were
just kind enough to be able to help me
to be able to learn kind of fast forward
from that three years later I had quite
a lot of object-oriented design under my
belt I played a bit with MATLAB and
played a bit with a bunch of other
programming languages too and I started
volunteering some time working at the
Framingham YMCA in Massachusetts and
there was a girl her name is Kristy she
was in elementary school and she was
learning about fractions and I was
helping her I was a mathematician and I
was helping her sort of sitting with her
to do her mathematics and share her
confidence was so low and what I was
really sitting with her and helping her
to do with C no no this stuff is totally
attainable it's totally doable here are
some cool uses for some reasons I was
talking her about frequencies and
waveforms and kind of connecting how the
reciprocal of the frequency is the
amplitude the height of the wave and
starting to talk a little bit more about
how you can do projects with that and
things like that's that project based
instruction that's sort of sitting with
her and learning while doing I sort of
simulated what I was experiencing as an
engineer for her and it turns out it
worked really good for her and I guess I
got hooked that's how I
I guess circle back now that's my
favorite thing to do as a teacher is to
sit with students and to help them to be
able to feel what I felt when engineers
were kind to me and that one-on-one
apprenticeship style model can be very
effective yes I'm curious I said I only
took two classes formally one in high
school and one during grad school that
related to computer science outside of
that it was all informal learning I
imagine a lot of other educators who are
new to CSS are trying to figure out how
do I learn how to program especially
something like C++ which is like a
nightmare of syntax compared to some
other languages what would you recommend
in terms of advice for how to learn if
the teacher does not have access to an
engineer is kind enough to sit down and
teach them that's a really great
question I would start by going to some
trainings there's some really great
trainings that are out there in 480
computer science a computer science
principles and then also
the other computer science courses that
are out there - in terms of cryptography
and cybersecurity I would recommend gen
cyber it was excellent training for me
in terms of the APS I think a really
good idea to start with a ap consultant
course
so there's week-long courses all over
the country that's a really great place
to start but keep in mind that's gonna
be focused on you know the AP exam yes
there's pedagogy in there too you also
want to sort of beef up by I think
really to this day every summer I still
attend some sort of training so just
never ever stop learning and also I'm
I'm hoping that this gets released in
time that it would still be true but
Coursera offers a ton of courses right
now they're free given the extra down
time I guess that people are expected to
have although I'm not finding I have
that downtime but I would really
recommend checking out some of those
courses kind of depending on how choose
to learn and how much you have to stay
at home not everybody can travel to
training those Coursera courses can
really help just scratch that itch too
and then you know there's a ton of
resources online
there's website called coding that
there's another website called repla and
they come with a ton of supports that
would help you to be able to learn when
it comes to the elementary or middle
school programming there's really great
resources like your resource Jared on
scratch boot up right and then there's a
ton of other resources that are in terms
of scratch like scratch.mit.edu would
link you to a ton of great resources and
again to circle back to the AP computer
science principles course if scratch is
your thing beauty and joy of computing
does use that but then there's a ton of
other curricula and I wish I wish I had
more time over the summer I think I'd
probably go to one of the AP computer
science principles trainings every
summer there's so many really good
endorse providers now for that course I
think there's a lot of really great
resources out there yeah the promised
time yeah yeah I personally learned from
several different approaches that you
mentioned so it wasn't just like going
to one and okay now I know everything I
need to know it's just continuous
learning whether it be on YouTube or an
online course or a physical in-person
course although there's probably not a
lot of those going on at the moment all
things considered can you tell me a
story about your experiences in
education that impacts you today
actually the story of impact that
so most to me is the one where I know
that student was successful because
somehow they grew more confident as they
were with me and I got to see that
confidence and then I got to see what
happened when they left and they were
able to be successful elsewhere I'm
gonna tell a story about a student I'm
not gonna mention her name but when I
first met her she was a sophomore in an
honors precalculus course I'm certain
where she to listen she would know who
she is when I was brand-new to the
course or to the school system so I was
nervous too and she didn't expect me to
be there she expected her other teacher
to be there so I'm sure she was nervous
as well I asked them to each share like
a fun fact about themselves before we
move forward and kind of just start the
year off right and she was so nervous to
say something that she really burst out
into tears well I felt terrible but I
saw I didn't of course press her to keep
going I said geez I want to get to know
her more and I want to try to do what I
can to help and so kind of fast-forward
her senior year was the first year that
I offered AP Computer Science a and that
was the only computer science course
that she could take and she and I by
then had a good enough relationship that
I got her to take the course now fast
forward after she left AP Computer
Science a not only was she certain she
wanted to be a problem solver she wanted
to study computer science she went on
and went to a great university to study
computer science they did well by her
and she is now working at Google and
she's in charge of working on the
YouTube side of Google where she's
keeping children safe so looking for
people with bad intentions putting
things in YouTube videos that shouldn't
be there and keeping children away from
being able to see them and her heart was
always so great you know she was always
just this amazing person and I just
think it's really cool that if I can
help us soon to see how amazing they are
and give them skills so that they can
show that to the world that is just the
best thing and I love hearing from her
still to this day I'll hear from her
and each time I talked to her she sounds
more confident more resilient more
skilled oh my gosh the skills that she's
got is amazing and I just I think that's
that's my favorite thing and she's not
the only one but she was by far the most
pronounced in terms of confidence that I
saw grow probably
just raw skill ability and she's just a
problem-solver by nature it was just
really neat to help her hone those
skills and then to see her do something
with them do something great and thrive
with it it sounds like yeah yeah it's
it's nice seeing kids how they kind of
develop over time and then what they do
when they're outside of school and like
beyond their education out outside of
whatever classes you're dealing that's
one of my favorite parts about like the
longer I've been in education the more I
see students as they continue to grow
and whatnot just like seeing them be
successful in life and remembering where
they started and like how they got there
and whatnot it's a fun journey so if you
were to go to a brand new school and
you're asked to design like a brand new
CS program in terms of like the classes
and what would you consider for the
design of that kind of a program in
terms of like how you would facilitate
it and like what kind of things students
would engage in
the most important thing is to consider
where you want your students to end up
and I'm an analytic person by design I
really like the idea of starting where
you want to end up and using a structure
that you trust the computer science
teachers association has developed a ton
of outstanding standards that are
vertically aligned to K through 12 start
there and the framework is excellent so
it actually breaks it down by grade
level what it is that you're hoping that
students would be able to achieve at
each grade and it's multiple streams so
there's some stuff about networking
there's some stuff about keeping
students safe online
all that K through 12 so start there I
would also really be careful about the
teachers that you recruit to be able to
teach these courses it's really
important that they understand they have
to have an ongoing commitment to
learning and they have to have an
ongoing commitment to equity they have
to be very aware of the fact that not
everybody is given an opportunity to
play with a robot when they're
celebrating their birthdays or whatever
holidays matter to their family in fact
it's a very narrow population of people
that are given those opportunities and
as a result that very narrow population
sometimes appears presents to have more
Skills than a population that wouldn't
be given access to those tools kind of
the second piece of that is those
students although they may appear more
confident they may be able to play with
the tools but that doesn't still even
mean that they understand what they're
playing and so again that goes back to
teacher training and being really
purposeful who you're deciding to pick
they can't be fooled by bells and
whistles or sort of fooled into thinking
that this is a course where the students
just simply learn a skill you'd want to
avoid naming a course after a
programming skill and instead try to
name the course after a programming
topic or concept instead I would avoid
if you can naming a course robotics and
instead consider calling it by the grade
level computer science grade whatever
and really just try to hit those skills
that are in the standards for that grade
level
now all that aside when you do that not
every school you know grade 12 for one
school might be grade 10 for another
school so look at those standards and
look at where they end up and if that's
true then if your grade 12
might actually be a great 10 student
then consider looking to colleges for
those more advanced coursework so for
example if AP Computer Science a is not
gonna be a high enough bar for the
population of students then consider you
know full stat programming or some of
the more so consider how you're gonna
beef those things up to write so then
once you start with that top level down
then from there decide who's going to
teach it and really get that team of
teachers together and help them to be
symbols of light symbols of inspiration
in the school to hopefully spread it and
integrate it as much as possible
computer science does not have to be a
one-off course like you could never
imagine teaching a science course
without mathematics I could never
imagine teaching mathematics without
some reading I think the same is true
with computer science and the idea that
there's a ton of teachers that are doing
a great job of integrating computer
science using code.org materials etc
keep that going but now make it
purposeful and connect it to curriculum
too and then the final thing I would
really recommend that districts do is
look into something called script
training script training is just
outstanding I just attended as a
facilitator in Denton Texas in January
we took a district team down there and
now we're working as a district to be
able to implement some of the things
that we learned it is not a one-stop
solution it's a beginning of your
district's journey by the time you leave
you end up with tentative three months
six month and nine months plan for your
district to help you to be able to move
forward so again it's kind of first up
if you don't have enough time or you
know to be able to do all the things I
said first stop is those K through 12
standards and frameworks second stop be
real careful about teachers and who
you're hiring or looking for to be able
to do this encourage teachers to kind of
integrate encourage them to experiment
and remember equity remember that not
every student has had access to these
resources and be mindful of it might
might be really intimidating for some
students and frankly some ste teachers
and that's okay so kind of be kind and
let those teachers be inspiration to try
to spread this all over your district in
your schools and your kids will thank
you and your parents will thank you and
multiple other guests have also
recommended scripts and a couple of my
co-workers our scripts were sealed
so they really enjoy the process I've
heard many good things about it but I
haven't participated in it so what are
the things that you talked about earlier
was related to advice to new CSS Gators
like how to learn and whatnot but I'm
wondering what recommendations you might
give to a veteran si s educator who's
been doing this for a while and has like
gone to all of the workshops and whatnot
I'm like cool I have a firm
understanding but what next how can I
continue to improve what I'm doing
Coursera is really nice for that I would
still suggest back to Coursera I'm
having really great results playing a
bit with some of the more advanced
Coursera courses they're the you know
some of the best universities across the
country taught by some of the best
teachers it's a really great reference
I'd also recommend some businesses allow
teachers to coop over the summer over
the summer if you've got free time again
I know that that's a tough thing but you
know consider interning essentially or
volunteering your time or certainly
working for payment remember you know as
teachers teaching job but we have a
skill set that might be quite marketable
if we were to you know I'm not
suggesting that this is what we should
do permanently but I think some
businesses might be really interested in
hiring us even if it's temporarily and
imagine what you learn using industry
practices and also industry equivalent
tools you know you'll come back to the
classroom like we did after student
teaching going off Wow
I understand so much more now the
classroom moves so much slower for me
because I'm wiser you know so I think I
think that's probably the next step to
be able to get you know some actual
agile training maybe even attending boot
camps I know that those are kind of
sprouting up all over the country to
allow people to be able to get training
that want to transition into software we
have to be honest and say this is to
help our students but that would be
really helpful and then the other side
of that is the computer science teachers
association if you were to become a
member and that would be for all
teachers you know not just the teachers
that are more advanced but also
beginning teachers you would find
comrades or friends and other districts
that maybe are doing things different
from what you're doing and you'd be able
to learn from them and in addition you'd
have a chance to give back a little bit
you know someone helped you along the
way
that's a really nice thing about
computer science teachers and
association is it gives you an
opportunity to give back a bit and to be
able to help other people and helping
others as you know is a great way to
learn right yeah and especially if
you're a veteran educator if you can run
for a board position on your local
chapter I highly recommend that so we're
both on boards and our own states and I
really enjoy my experience with it and I
imagine the same for you agree and then
the kind of the final extension of that
to an additional extension is the AP
readings if you're an AP teacher
consider participating in AP computer
science principles a we're always
looking for readers I've been a table
leader for a couple years now I was
going to be a question leader this year
but everything is changing a bit with
the reading you know so yeah the AP
program is excellent they have wonderful
training and becoming a reader is just
an excellent way to learn again for the
same networking benefits but also just I
think there's something really special
about getting yourself onto the rubric
and then learning from whatever the
biases you might be coming into that
problem with and then once you're on
rubric hitting a rhythm and knowing that
you're reading all students kind of
fairly and equitably it's really
excellent training yeah I think that's
great advice for AP and I really liked
your earlier suggestion of kind of
getting some industry experience knowing
where kids are gonna go if you are going
to be preparing kids for a career in
computer science like that's invaluable
it's a completely different thing to
understand just the content area versus
the content area in a context in which
you actually use it in an industry
setting I really hope industries are
listening to because we definitely need
those opportunities even if it's two to
three weeks it can you imagine what a
difference it would make for teachers or
you know internships
you know there's businesses all around
us where we're working and you know we
can work from home too
it would be amazing for businesses to
kind of see that as an opportunity and
then you know lo and behold those
students will see that hey there
teachers working for this business well
that says something really powerful
about that business that hopefully will
open a portal for not just the teachers
but also the students to be able to
contribute sooner have internships
sooner I'd love to have more back and
forth between local businesses and the
education guild so that we can support
and help each other and then have a more
qualified and better prepared workforce
for them yeah so you had
mentioned integrating through like
code.org and whatnot I'm wondering what
advice you would give to educators who
are starting to teach CS and are
interested in integrating it into a
subject area outside of just CS by
itself again I think there's a whole
host of things that you could look at
what's happening in the field that
you're in right now and talk to somebody
who's doing that job and ask them how is
computer science that's Lansing them
you'll get great answers invite them in
as guest speakers for your students so
that you and your students can both hear
and then use that as inspiration for
your first project that's an excellent
starting place an example is I have a
colleague that teaches right next door
to me he's a social studies teacher he
invited a data science person he teaches
political consultant to come in and that
person was in charge of polling and kind
of getting a pulse on what people think
and he used data science to be able to
analyze brought in that information talk
to him he and this social studies
government teacher was just blown away
by the amount of computer science so
then he started to dig into the data he
started to use some tools like
gapminder.org really helped him to be
able to get a pulse on like social
issues and once he started playing with
gapminder.org that was sort of the
beginning of his journey in helping
students to be able to see where
patterns might be able to be found in
data well that can lead you to making
social points that you couldn't made if
it wasn't for that data and those
stories then become a convincing
argument to help people to be able to
influence positive change so that's one
example
I really think two friendships can make
a huge difference small conversations
with colleagues that are open and kind
again at Connard hi I work with a
teacher who is also upstairs
she teaches Spanish and she was open
enough during the hour of code to use
the Moana hour of code app and then to
teach her children how to do direction
in Spanish using that hour of code she's
just a light you know so these and this
social studies teacher again alight and
students appreciate it so much because
they see now the computer science it's
not one course and they know this they
use these tools all the time it gives
them a bit of a power a bit of a leg up
for
to be able to use it as a tool with
something that they love maybe even
something that surprised them a little
bit programming graphing calculators in
the high school level for high school
mathematics courses can be you know a
source of light for younger students
encouraging them to when they do use an
image in a PowerPoint slide
they don't just simply use it but they
also cite it and include proper
citations when a younger child is going
online do not use your last name they
should never use their last names again
in terms of just staying secure and safe
online and the teachers model that
behavior that you also cite images that
we use in our slide
I think this is a missing please and
thank you like we would never for a
kindergarten class not say to our
students hey make sure you say please
and thank you when you're asking for
that or is that a proper way to ask for
something isn't there a word that's
missing you know and I think the same is
true with you know computer science and
being safe online did you just put your
last name or is that safe how did you
send that email to that teacher is that
an appropriate way to communicate to
them is there a period at the end of
that sentence
you know but I think I do think that
it's sort of the missing really large
elephant there's a reason why it's
missing it can be scary for teachers and
it can be scary a bit for students the
whole point of Education is to help
students to make good choices based on
knowledge not fear and so if we can
model that for them then we're closer to
I think helping them to be able to work
through helping our society work through
the issues that we might be still having
with computer science yeah I'm curious
what are some potential pitfalls that
other educators should look out for when
they're trying to do some integration
that it's okay if you don't know if
you're unsure I think a lot of teachers
and with good reason used to being
experts in their field and that's a
beautiful thing there is no way to be an
expert in the field and there's no way
to produce a perfect product when you're
teaching computer science it's a
constant reinvention it's a constant
learning often the students because they
have more time to create and they have
more time to learn than we do we're sort
of guiding them and we're helping them
and we're learning and that's okay
that's completely normal and it can be
really I think relieving it takes a lot
of pressure off and it also is really
joyful to join your student
in the learning process as opposed to
being their one source of knowledge yeah
I'd like to share so like I think it was
every Thursday in my classes it was like
we'd start with debugging and I would
share either a bug that I was personally
working on and like here's how I solve
this particular bug I was trying to
figure out or I would showcase here's a
famous bug in a video game then here's
what might have gone wrong with this and
how it relates to the projects that
you're working on I think kind of
sharing that and just being human and
being like look I make mistakes too I'm
constantly problem solving just like you
it kind of normalizes it and makes it
less scary and hopefully more accepting
because even if you don't want it you're
gonna run into bugs mm-hmm
so you mentioned equity earlier and I'm
wondering what you wish more CS
educators understood about equity and
inclusivity in CS education so my
parents they never learned how to swim
and so when we would go to the beach or
we would go to the and they and they
learn how to tread water ish but because
they grew up in northern Maine they
didn't really need to swim and they
didn't necessarily have access to pools
or any place to learn how to swim and
that meant that when we'd go to the
beach or we go to the water with any of
those family members there was a lot of
fear and I didn't judge them for that
because I thought to myself that's not
their fault they just they don't know
they've never seen it if you see an
animal you know like a dog that is
afraid to go up to a balloon because it
scares them you know you wouldn't sort
of get them closer to the balloon in a
in a mean way or you know sort of set up
a roomful of Blues you would you know
sort of gently maybe kindly give them a
balloon that's a little deflated maybe
give them a lot of treats as they get
closer and closer to that balloon that's
the only kind way to be able to help any
animal or when you have somebody that's
afraid of swimming like I said the right
way to piano that is to be sensitive to
that and I think right now for computer
science because people's experiences are
so different
if somebody's never studied computer
science until they've gone to high
school that they can look at the room of
computers and it can be a bit like a
room of balloons for that person and so
first I think in terms of equity
exposure is
but it needs to be kind and fair
exposure that's positive with lots of
access points lots of rooms for students
to have success because again I think
there's a whole host of reasons why
people wouldn't necessarily have
experience with computer science and
some of it is just it's not their fault
and so as educators I think we need to
be really really sensitive to that and
then we need to be also sensitive to the
fact that students reactions to that
situation meaning computer science might
be really different when some students
are really confused they might act out
or they might be disrespectful or they
might shy away they might be really
hesitant to respond because of
confidence issues and none of those
things mean that they can't do it it
just means that they need different
support they need more sensitivity they
need more access points they need a
different way to be able to see
computers and there's some things that
teachers can do to really just even
soften the environment so I think be
wary of the way classrooms are decorated
consider putting things near the
computer that sort of soften it up or
even if it seems ridiculous I have
stuffed animals all over my room and
some students just they reach into this
vat of stuffed animals and they bring
them over to the computer and they talk
to them if they're having programming
difficulties and it seems so silly but
it's really wonderful and there's some
students that I know they're having a
difficulty if they'll ask them which
stuffed animal would you like are you
feeling the Unicorn so bring those over
and give them something that's different
that's a little softer a little kinder
to be able to help them to be able to
feel good about computer science and to
not be in - I really I think those those
couple things would probably work at any
grade level and like I said in terms of
curriculum designing many on-ramps
designing many ways for students to be
creative you know students maybe they're
passionate about arts give them art
projects different ways that they can be
able to create using computer science
needing music is they give them a way to
be able to create using music and it's
okay that maybe you don't know yet how
to do that if you have a student who is
motivated by athletics or a student
that's motivated by the health field if
that's sort of their draw they will find
ways to be able to learn that and
they'll blow you away with what they can
do so I'd recommend trying to define
different access points for students and
then trying to do what you can to
decorate the room and then
be careful about how you recruit for
your classes especially if it's optional
in the high school level if you asked
students at universally do you want to
take computer science often you'll get
the overzealous and overconfident
students that will say yes that doesn't
necessarily mean they should maybe
they'd be great at the course and I mean
I think all students of course should
take computer science but you know not
every computer science course and then
you know you'll have some students that
really should feel confident but they
don't so just be really careful about
how you recruit and I think one-on-one
conversations with teachers and students
do you say you believe in a student if
you say that they can do it they will
believe you I have zero doubt and how do
you recruit kids
if you've haven't had them in a class
before and you don't really know them
are you going out and speaking to other
teachers and like hey who do you think
would be a great fit for this kind of
class or what advice would you give my
colleague in my school and in my system
they're really amazing support that way
so my department head allows me to work
with my colleagues to present in their
math courses so in that way we're
speaking to really close to a hundred
percent of the populations I bring
students because they're much better
than I am at explaining what is this
computer science thing computer science
in our school is taught in multiple
departments so that's the other thing
like try not to be so weary about which
department can or cannot teach it I
think my dream is that all departments
eventually will be able to teach
computer science it's probably the right
solution but in the meantime in our
school we teach it in the technology and
the mathematics department but we
advertise so I delivering to all the
math courses but we're advertising all
the courses so and students are talking
about all the courses this to them it's
just computer science who cares which
department is teaching it you know that
can really help in terms of recruitment
the word-of-mouth students sort of
explaining what the courses are and then
from there we encourage one-on-one
conversations with teachers so each
teacher sort of should be meeting
one-on-one with students to be able to
explain to them what is this computer
science thing and also how it would help
them to be successful a lot of good
advice in there and earlier when I had
asked you about your like ideal UCS
program if you design one you mentioned
recruiting teachers what kind of advice
might you give for how to recruit CS
educators so you want to choose
educators that understand that they're
gonna always
learning they're never going to be able
to put this curriculum into a box and
say oh okay next year I'll do it exactly
the same way so you want someone who's
got this joy for learning right that it
would never be happy to box their
curriculum and put it on the shelves
they would always want to join their
students to be able to learn I would
really recommend if districts are
looking for a resource to figure out
what is a great computer science teacher
the CSTA the computer science teachers
association just released the really
great standards document you could
certainly refer to that document that
would really give you a sense sort of
the equivalent you know they have those
same sets of standards for what makes a
great math teacher or what makes a great
English teacher they have the equivalent
that the computer science teachers
association just created for computer
science teachers that would be a really
great starting point and that's the SDC
sta-1 where they like jointly created it
correct yep and it's excellent I just
came out fall 29 they're working on like
creating resources to help PD providers
kind of prepare for that I'm on a team
that's helping with that so it's great
how much support there is for not just
they're not just like okay here are the
new standards but they're like actively
trying to help teachers with these
standards and preparing for it but I
agree I really like the the teacher
standards for SDC SDA and then the
second resource might be the script
rubrics one of the aspects that a
district should look at is curriculum
and teacher training and each of those
are detailed out so sort of spread out
over what's a beginning skill for a
district what's an advanced skill I'm
using the wrong language but they really
just move what does it mean to be to
have a good group of teachers teaching
computer science grades K through 12
from beginning to proficient and then
advanced and so it would really help a
district to be able to see what it
probably maybe looks like now and then
what it could look like from a district
perspective speaking of the CSTA earlier
you'd mentioned that we're both on
boards for our state chapters I'm
curious what have you learned as a
result of your experience I'm
volunteering for organizations like CSD
a I've learned that as a teacher that
it's really important to do what you can
to help other teachers but to also set
boundaries the other I guess the second
piece that I've learned is to realize
that there's a lot of work that needs to
be done and there's not enough people
right now
that are stepping up and working hard to
do it and if more people would step up
then we would just have a much better
product for students and for the future
I know that there are so many amazing
computer science teachers and I know
part of the problem is everybody's just
keeping their head afloat right we're
all just doing what we can in our lives
to feel like we're getting by and life
is so busy but if you would be able to
spare a moment to be able to help the
Computer Science Teachers Association is
a really great organization and we need
help there's more jobs than we can do
and it would be really amazing if more
people would participate actively take
on those leadership roles help with the
website help with training I'm certain
if you talk computer science longer than
two years you know something that would
help other people and if you're just
starting computer science then we really
need your help too because we want to
maintain that that perspective right we
don't want to lose so everybody could
really contribute so much by becoming an
active member I really hope that more
people will yeah and the questions that
like a new CSS occator would ask can
help refine some of the supports that
are provided by veteran educators and
people who do volunteer it's a 100%
voluntary right at the state level so
you go because your heart's in it right
and I know so many teachers have their
heart in it
so bring that to the CSTA join us that
would be really great more people would
really really help us and it would be
more fun too yeah I agree and the more
perspectives at the table the better I
was just gonna say I don't want to I the
computer science teacher Association
they're very involved we've done a lot
you know it's just I think more people
would be great I volunteer at like CSTA
and some other organizations but then I
also volunteer like at Habitat for
Humanity on the weekend to like help
build houses at least before the
lockdown from kovat and whatnot we were
doing that but what's interesting is one
of the team leaders there is a
researcher and he was saying that
volunteerism across the nation has been
down in the last few years so there's
not enough people doing it I don't know
if it's just people don't realize that
they can do it or if it's just not
enough advocacy from organizations like
asking for people to help out but
there's certainly a lot of opportunities
that can be done in the world of CS
education for volunteering and helping
anything some of it is just that people
teachers are so busy yeah I completely
understand that yep yeah and I mean on
that note like given the the various
like demands and pressures of being in
education how do you try and stave off
that burnout and how are you taking care
of yourself like we're recording this at
the end of March and things are chaotic
at the moment in in the US so what are
you doing to kind of like help yourself
so that way you can help others he got
into this computer science thing well my
daughter was three years old she's now
she's she's the reason why I still
firmly believe all students should be
able to take computer science in my mind
I want her to have an experience that
was different and better than my
experience was with computer science and
and that's already to some extent
happening for her but I have this strong
feeling that that the work is just never
done and so I guess that that's where
the flame comes from as far as the
balance I think it's really important
everyday for you to schedule a little
sanity time for yourself as best as you
can yeah I think physical activity can
make a huge difference in your mental
well-being and your mental state I
really try to exercise three four or
five times a week if I can that makes a
huge difference for me and I try to take
time to do the things that really
motivate me and make me happy like
spending time with my family and friends
doing crafts even if that means I can't
do the work that needs to get done for
next week or even for tomorrow it's okay
that work is not going anywhere I think
we've got to take time for ourselves or
like you said we will burn out I've also
you know if it's not required for
tomorrow
then it's it's optional as best as I can
however I do do this thing called touch
paper once so if I see an email or if I
you know see a paper if I can't
accomplish I really try to see it do it
address it and move on as opposed to
hemming and hawing you know as best as I
can you can't always do that but you
know like if it's a big report or a big
grant you have to revisit
again but if it's something that I can
read process once that's saves time
versus reading and processing again and
again every time you read an email you
have to take more time to process it
those are just a couple of tips but you
know exercise I think is one of the most
important things and time with people
that you love time with your family your
friends can really make a difference
yeah especially in these times yeah yeah
those are really good suggestions and I
also follow a lot of those especially
the idea of just like touching the paper
once it's it's very helpful so you're
not just constantly going back to the
same thing over and over and wasting
your mental energy on it do you have any
questions for myself for to the field at
large the question I always like to ask
people is you know was there a teacher
was there someone that inspired you what
was it about them that do you think it's
shaped who you are in computer science
as a computer science teacher now and
yeah from my standpoint I've had a lot
of really good educators in my life that
I borrow bits and pieces from like oh I
really love that this person was great
at this and I'm gonna incorporate that
in my classroom but I've also had some
really problematic experiences in
education where I've seen things done
and I go I'm gonna do the exact opposite
of that because of X Y MZ so with both
ends of a continuum I'm drawing from
them and learning lessons from and
trying to incorporate it into the
classroom but it wasn't necessarily like
one person that I'm like I'm really
trying to model everything that they're
doing it's like oh I love that this
person is fantastic at this and I didn't
try and incorporate that into my class
but much like with the content knowledge
that my pedagogy is just like constantly
evolving I'm always learning new things
and so as I meet more educators and like
through these interviews and like I go
into conferences when they're in person
and things like that like learning for
more people I just borrowed bits and
pieces from them so what are you
learning right now right now I'm
learning like from a personal level how
to deal more with uncertainty because of
obviously like March or 2020 things are
uncertain in terms of what's the US and
the world gonna look like a month from
now or six months from now
professionally speaking right now I'm
working on a project for a grant for
Wyoming where I'm creating the
curriculum is going to integrate
computer science with social studies
specifically the indian for all
standards so we're working with the Wind
River Northern Arapaho and Eastern
Shoshone tribes and the projects that
I'm creating are going to be related to
those tribes and like the kids on the
reservation are going to use them and
then eventually it's going to be
disseminated across the state and then
across like worldwide so I'm personally
working on how do I find meaningful and
interesting ways of connecting social
studies standards with computer science
standards and then today I was actually
looking at English and language arts
standards so like how can we make these
stories that relate to tribal stories
that are going to be then used in some
kind of a computer science project that
kids would find interesting to them and
is culturally relevant and meaningful to
them so like that's the biggest thing
that I'm working on is that that area
what about for you was there any
educator are there things that you're
personally working on I'm learning how
to balance right now on a personal I
think my whole approach to teaching has
changed within two weeks right so how do
I make videos I know in my mind what
should be more important is how my
students are learning however there's a
lot of time spent on how can I help them
to get to the classes that I'm offering
online how do I support them if they're
not making it there what does that look
like how can i what can I do what can I
do to you know if they're not showing up
how can I help them to want to show up
you know right and then also how can I
make videos that aren't completely lame
but an hour less than five minutes but
that that do the job to help them that
they would want to be able to dig in
just to learn like that's basically
we're asking them to learn not because
of a grade not because we're gonna check
a box because they showed up but because
it's just joyful to learn it's a
challenge I think because for many of
them that's not been their approach
where's what I'm learning I'm returning
to knitting like so I knitted quite a
lot when I was maybe like maybe eight
ten years ago and so I'm relearning
those stitches kind of for fun because
I'd like to try to learn how to knit the
sweater or something a little bit bigger
but I'm sort of building up to that in
terms of computer science I am
continuing to learn more
more Python languages their treasure
troves if you never run out of things to
do with them right there's an interview
that I did with and gun that hasn't
released yet and she talked about how
there's a lot of computer science in
knitting and in like the stitch work
that she does and how you're basically
working through an algorithm and whatnot
it's it's interesting and I hadn't ever
thought of it that way
I don't know if you ever looked at your
knitting as computer science and like
how they intersect in various ways yeah
I have a really big creative side so it
just scratches yeah you could totally
see it as a problem is it's a little
messier than I would a computer you know
if you drop a restart the program so
before we go I'm wondering if you could
share where people could go to connect
with you online and the organizations
that you work with I have no social
media except for LinkedIn I've just
became a lot of overhead so LinkedIn is
a really good resource also they're
welcome to anything that's probably a
really great start as long as they spell
my last name right that's the hardest
part and with that that concludes this
week's episode of the cska podcast just
a friendly reminder
I do link to many of the resources that
jackie mentioned in this episode
including Jackie's LinkedIn profile as
well as hundreds of debugging exercises
that I've created that you can use in
your classroom for free all of the
various courses and ciphers and
resources that jackie mentioned
throughout the podcast if you enjoyed
this episode please consider sharing
with a friend who might be interested in
reaching these resources and hearing
from jackie or consider providing a
review on whatever platform you listen
to this on stay tuned next week for
another unpacking scholarship episode
where i will talk about some potential
implications of the latest research in
CS education what it means for your
classroom and then two weeks from now it
will be another interview thanks so much
for listening I hope you're all staying
healthy and are having a wonderful week

Guest Bio

Jacqueline Corricelli has been a public school educator since Fall 2003. She works at Conard High School, West Hartford, CT where she teaches mathematics, AP Computer Science Principles, and AP Computer Science A. Prior to this, she taught at East Windsor High School. This is a second career for Jackie who, after earning her degree in Mathematics and Statistics, worked for three years for Raytheon as a Radar Systems Engineer. Jackie believes that high school students at all levels can, and should learn computer science. Jackie sees computer science as a way to help students become better problem solvers. Supported and inspired by her family, students, supervisor, and coworkers, she sought approval, pursued training, and designed curriculum to offer AP Computer Science A, AP Computer Science Principles, and Cryptography & Cybersecurity for the first time in her school system. Jackie’s passion for computer science education goes beyond the classroom. She volunteers as the Vice President of the CT Computer Science Teachers Association and as a member of the Connecticut State Department of Education CS Advisory Group created to improve access to and define computer science education at the state level. Until July 2020, she has worked as a CSTA Equity Fellow and is currently working to bring SCRIPT Training to Connecticut. She is a Table Leader for Grading AP CS Principles and was a Pilot Teacher, Phase II for this course. Jackie has a B.A. in math and statistics from the University of Connecticut and a M.S. in mathematics secondary education from Westfield State University. She is a certified secondary mathematics teacher. She and her family reside in East Granby, CT.