Recommendations for Preventing Burnout in Education (Part 2)
Building off the previous episode on depression, suicide, and CS education, this episode is a supercut of guests responding to how they take care of themselves and stave off burnout. If you have not done so yet, I highly recommend listening to last year’s supercut on the same topic, but with different guests.
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Welcome back to another episode of the
CSK8 podcast my name is jared o'leary
about a year ago i released an episode
that was a super cut on preventing
burnout and education so a supercut is
when you take excerpts from a variety of
different episodes and put them all
together into one episode on a single
topic so in this week's episode we are
going to listen to the responses from
all the guests who are asked how they
prevent burnout in education in the
excerpts that you're about to hear
you're mostly going to hear just the
guests giving their advice on preventing
burnout but sometimes i include the
exchange that the guest and i had now i
will announce in between each one of
these excerpts which episode this is
from by giving you the title for it and
i also include a link to the particular
episode as well as the description of
the episode in the show notes which you
can find at jaredaleri.com or by
clicking the link in the app that you're
listening to this on if you haven't
listened to last year's episode i highly
recommend starting there and then take a
listen to this particular year's episode
as there's some wonderful guests and
some wonderful information on how to
prevent burnout in education alright so
the first excerpt is from episode 51
learning at scale with kristin stevens
martinez
so
for me the biggest thing
was faculty diversity.org so it is the
national center for faculty development
and diversity and
i found this resource
i think after faculty orientation maybe
which for me was after a semester of
being at duke because i started in the
spring semester
and so i went to orientation like a
semester late which actually in some
ways is more useful like going to
orientation after you've been there a
semester is you have you actually know
what questions you want answered
and it's a resource intended to help you
figure out how to make being a faculty
make sense without burning yourself out
so they have extremely
practical webinars where it's like
go through this hour and a half webinar
and by the end of it you'll have a plan
for your semester
and go through this one and now you will
start learning the process of planning
your week every single week
and
there's a lot of like tips and tricks
and those kinds of things that you can
do in there and when i found this
resource i was like this is this seems
very useful to help me start figuring
stuff out
and
i
was horrible at the beginning of
following their advice like it took time
to figure it out and i was working
evenings and i was working weekends and
i was like i hate this one reason
actually i decided to be a professor of
the practice and i guess i we should
define what that is so professor of the
practice is someone who focuses more on
teaching rather than research at duke
university and
there is some expectations of scholarly
work but what's nice at duke is that we
can kind of define what that means to
ourselves and so for myself my scholarly
work is going to focus more on research
with some outreach like my podcast
but like some people define it in other
ways
and so
i chose to be
a professor of the practice
because
i looked at
the professors at berkeley which was my
main way of comparing my main yardstick
because that's where i went to grad
school and admittedly it's not the most
calibrated yardstick
now that i've been away for a while but
i look at them and i'm like i don't want
your life
i was like i don't want to work 60 hours
a week i don't want to have this huge
pressure of finding grants and
publishing i don't want any of that i
want to have the weekends to myself i
want the weekends to my i want the
evenings for my family
and so that's one reason why i chose
professor the practice because i was
like i know at least i can do teaching
well
and as long as i do that well they're
not going to fire me and so if i have to
like
do lots of other things
to get that work-life balance
no one is going to fire me over it
and anything else i want to do on top of
that like my podcast on my research i
will do because i want to and it fits
into my life
obviously though i did not know what i
was doing in the beginning so i was
still working weekends and all of that
and then adding the practices that i was
learning from
this resource was great because it
started
making certain things more visible and
more real and helped give me the tools
to figure out how to tweak that so for
example the weekly planning meeting
is where you list out all the things you
have to do
and then you match those things to your
calendar like you literally block out
time on your calendar like this is when
i'm going to work on x another thing
where they have you track your time like
how long does it take you to actually
actually do things because everyone
suffers the planning fallacy of it
always takes longer than you expect it
to right and so happening you track your
time helps you figure that out i am a
data nerd because you know i'm a
computer scientist and a data scientist
so i still collect my time like i know
exactly how long i spend on everything
to the 15-minute increment for work and
i did this in grad school before even
learning about doing this as a faculty
so picking up that habit again was very
easy for me so knowing that information
i am better at estimating how long it
takes me to do things i still screw up
like i estimated for reviewing for 60 it
was going to take me an hour and a half
per paper no it took me like two hours
per paper or like two and a half hours
per paper so i was still off but i was
not as off as i could have been
and so like blocking out my calendar and
then in the beginning
it made it very real to me to realize
that i was underestimating how long
things were taking me because i had to
drag those blocks to like the weekend
like i didn't finish this thing so now i
have to put this in the weekend and now
i'm spending weekend time and i feel
this pain i'm going to remember this
pain
so i will fix what i'm doing to stop
doing this it took me like a year before
i stopped like
working on weekends
and
working in the evenings like we had one
kid at the time so like after the kid
was in bed like pulling up my laptop and
doing extra like email and that kind of
thing it took me a long time but that's
kind of probably the biggest things for
me which was like accessing that
resource and a lot of universities have
yet university memberships there so just
check your university and see if it's in
that list because if it is then you have
free access to all this stuff planning
out my semester i go a little crazy in
how i plan my semester i plan it kind of
to the hour how many hours i'm doing
various things for various weeks but
like no one has to be as nuts as i am
[Music]
i do weekly planning i make deadlines
feel real
and so the way i do that is that the act
of planning out when i'm going to do
what
makes deadlines feel very real to me
because if i don't get it done in that
time i have moved everything else over
and that to me at least the deadline is
feels very real at that point because
i'm like well if i don't get this done
now i'm not going to get it done later
right or i have to shove something else
over so clearly this is the this
deadline is real even though technically
i don't have to do this for two weeks 60
technically we're all reviewing for 60
now and that due date is next week i'm
already done because i was like no if i
don't do this now i'm not going to get
it done later i've got other things to
do other things are tracking my time so
i know how long things take and then
i kind of mentioned this before it's
like making underestimating how long
something takes you feel the pain like
make you feel that pain so that you'll
reassess how to do better next time
i think it's still a balance i still
plan out my days and technically my day
is supposed to end at five but it never
ends at five it always end at like 5 30
or 6 and that's partially because i'm a
bit of a workaholic like i like to do
this stuff
and i have the advantage of we live in a
place where we can live on one income
and so my husband he's technically a
stay-at-home parent he supported me a
lot in grad school so i feel like this
is like the reciprocal i now hold the
red winner bucket and he had it before
but then what that means is like i can
continue working my office until he goes
to daycare picks up the three-year-old
and brings him home and i don't really
have to go downstairs as soon as the day
the three-year-old is home i can like
you know three-year-old can play with
his dominoes or whatever and i will
continue like getting rid of like
finishing some last email that's how i
kind of avoid burnout and right now also
as since i'm on parental leave i'm
currently going through a process now of
kind of rediscovering how to recharge
because of this combination of being a
workaholic and
having two kids now and trying to manage
two kids
all right so the next excerpt is titled
situated language and learning with
brian brown and this is from episode 53.
i've never had a greater motivation than
to wake up in the morning to know i've
got 35 kids waiting on me for 7 30 start
or 8 o'clock start and i need to be
ready by 7 30 and then the next hour
there's another set of kids and then
there's another prep so completely
different lesson plan for this third set
of kids that motivation has never left
me it's always been about preparing for
kids and impacting kids and communities
and so
as now a college professor that
motivation still exists it's easy to get
motivated and prepared for people the
research part i think the thing that has
kept me focused is that it continues to
move so if i started doing research on
language and identity and its impact on
science can't do that research anymore
because we've been there we've done
those studies and so the next question
is what does this mean so now as we move
to technology there's a new level of
interest and so
that part has been an enabling factor to
keep me motivated and focused because
one of the benefits of this job is
intellectual work so the ideas have to
be new so it's always moving you know
which is at least entertaining i can say
that much all right the excerpt from
episode 55 is titled nikki washington is
unapologetically dope i think this is
the first summer that i had zero time to
decompress so i had never in 15 years of
teaching
ever done summer school or anything so
my summer was always my time to kind of
just do whatever for three months
and then everything with covet packing
moving transitioning to a new job and
creating a new course and so i am kind
of five minutes and maybe one more class
lecture away from a full meltdown but i
say for me exercise
so i walk unfortunately i can't run
anymore due to knee injuries but i try
to walk not as much as i should so i
have to get back on a routine but that's
always very helpful for me music is a
huge
source of zen for me
i love music and honestly tv i'm a huge
tv junkie so tv shows and music and
podcasts are kind of getting me through
all of this especially tv and music more
so than anything so anyone who sees me
on twitter i'm always tweeting about
whatever i'm watching whatever i'm
listening to
that gives me life right now you know i
have to definitely appreciate things
like the versus series that started over
covid because it gives me a chance to
just
remember when and be nostalgic about
music that i enjoy tv shows like right
now i'm watching lovecraft country and
i'm so caught up in that and then even
you know before watchmen or i watch a
lot of old shows too so i'm either
alternating between martin king of
queens and golden girls and then during
the day i wake up and it's living single
girlfriends and in the heat of the night
i'm all over the place and i tell people
i'm high key using twitter kind of as my
own therapy right now so you know i may
be talking about something real serious
at one o'clock but by nine o'clock i'm
talking about something on tv or
something that's popping up and it's
hard because i feel like i'm an
extroverted introvert so i like to be by
myself but at the same time i like to do
it on my terms so for me being an only
child you know i could be very
comfortable being home so the first
couple of months or first couple of
weeks in march oh it was great i guess
just another weekend for me but then by
april 1st it was okay you know i've had
enough of this i need to see people and
engage and you know here it is we're
what
it's september and we're still not
outside yet so
i've had to really find ways to step
away from technology and just
veg out and for me
that's just been exercise music tv
because there's really not much else you
can do yet or we should be doing there's
a lot that some people are doing but
yeah i'm home and the next excerpt from
episode 57 is titled amplifying voices
for social justice with len diaz two
things come to mind and that i really
try to do almost on a daily basis one is
i really
have taken up exercising for me it
really is has been my outlet and i try
to do this you know every day i go for
long walks talking here and there in
some exercise and that really has helped
me to sort of remove myself from
the harsh realities the
political darkness you know sometimes
that we're facing and especially here
you know in georgia things of that
nature so i've gone into that more
consistently lately but the other thing
that i i do is i've really immersed
myself into becoming a better
coach for my team and the role that i
have i'm very fortunate to have a small
team and we
hone in on coaching skills and
strategies
to
help each other you know cope through
what we're all going through but more
importantly we leverage coaching and
coaching skills in the work that we do
with teachers so it helps all around it
helps us effectively
communicate collaborate and work
together and support each other as a
team
but it also helps
in having these conversations with
teachers and principals and
you know building trust and poor and
just knowing that
we can be there for each other but we're
also there for the schools that we're
working with so
done a little bit more
reading and freshening up on coaching
skills
and by the way i just want to put a plug
in for
audio books too
i love audiobooks and that's something
else that has helped me too is you know
to
not
honestly having to be on a screen for
hours and hours every day
you know i know that's not the same
thing as like picking up a book and
reading but audiobooks has really helped
me kind of also de-stress and you know
immersed in really good books all right
so the excerpt from episode 59 is titled
daily stem with chris woods number one
you got to make sure you spend time with
your family your friends your loved ones
just make sure that you're just spending
that good quality time with them play
games call grandma call grandpa call
whoever you know use that use that phone
for something besides you know chatting
and texting and tick-tocking but
honestly the biggest thing that keeps me
going as an educator is
being part of a team being part of a
team of educators now right now my
school is 100 virtual and so trying to
connect with my fellow educators it's a
little bit more of a challenge but we
have a group text we have microsoft
teams we have
all these different ways that we can
just stop and ask each other questions
when we're struggling and ask those
other teachers
around you are you struggling you know
hey can i help you with anything how's
it going you know you're a first year
teacher how's it going that's such a
powerful question that any educator
that's been teaching a while can ask
that's probably the most important
question and then also like just today i
posted i posted in our microsoft teams i
was like hey it's friday you know it's
so great working with all of you you
know just keep up the good work and
enjoy your weekend did i have to do that
no did anybody tell me to do that no i
just did it because
hey i'd want someone to do that for me
and number two knowing that i did that
also i think reminds me that i'm doing a
good job too and we can all encourage
each other so that's the biggest thing
if we can just keep on encouraging each
other and again especially look out for
those new teachers those young teachers
and things like that all right the
excerpt from episode 61 is titled
designing curricula at scale with gt
roble i think this is a challenge for
educators no matter what and my initial
answer is community i felt so much
solace with people frankly like you i
think with collaborators at code.org and
just
feeling like there's somebody else who
understands
sometimes it's just the pressure
especially the contrast between the
vision you have for how you want things
to be
and how things are
so sometimes i get tired because i have
a lot to do
like i gotta make an activity guide then
a vocab list and then a video script and
then whatever but i think
it was more exhausting if it felt like
my aspirations for you know what we
wanted to achieve for students or
you do think systemically you think big
it can sometimes feel overwhelming like
are we gonna get there
so i was gonna say that i think
community helps i think something i'm
finding this year i'm volunteering at
teals you and i are doing a project at
csta and i think
i feel reinvigorated picking
things that put me in touch with
individuals again and making it specific
and i think having about 50 kids and
working with them and they won't turn on
their cameras but it's okay because i'm
slowly getting to know everybody and i
think they're getting to know me i'm
excited i want to do it and i do think i
reached a point as a curriculum
developer where i said i don't know if i
can write another lesson right now about
introductory computer science topics or
at least not this year i don't know if i
can do it and part of that i think is
you know when you've written a few
hundred of them
right i don't know if i have anything to
say anymore you know or maybe i need to
do something else but i think that
people will say things all the time like
give yourself grace or take a break or
find a community but i've really i don't
know they're doing yoga i often was the
people would say like do yoga and i'd
say what are you talking about like this
is just papering over like an
unsustainable other circumstance
education is not going to get fixed by
me doing yoga right and if i give myself
grace that's not going to write that
activity guide
right you know or i could even say the
words but i don't know if i could feel
them so
maybe for people who think like me like
go do some stretches
if i were going to summarize community
focusing on specifics and the big
picture can sometimes be overwhelming so
saying i'm working with these 50 kids
and i'm trusting that'll influence the
work i do and then i'd say
if you're like me and people have said
things about
burnout and they say things like give
yourself grace or like do some yoga like
set up a schedule or whatever
it's easy to ignore and i think i
actually did if i'm being honest i don't
want to pretend to be an expert at this
i think if i were to be truly honest i
think i hit a tough spot earlier this
year i think a lot of educators did that
feeling of man this vision we had is
falling apart and so i think leaning
back towards
just sort of like the things people
often say to you but like give it a shot
all right what do you do does any of
that resonate with you oh definitely
like a plus one to yoga for sure when i
first went in to
see a therapist this was when i was like
at the point where i was either going to
commit suicide or do something to get
better and so i decided okay i might as
well give therapy a shot see if there
are things that i haven't tried that
could help and one of the things that
she recommended was doing yoga and i
ended up doing it twice a day hour in
the morning hour in the evening and like
between that and then like working on
breathing some more mindfulness stuff
like it really helped me to just chill
out and actually take time for myself to
just breathe and be as opposed to like
myself being a go go 24 7 if i didn't
have to sleep i wouldn't kind of a thing
it really helped out so that was a big
thing and then i eventually found just
getting consistent sleep was a big thing
for me eating healthier i started
learning more about nutrition and diet
and eventually became vegan over time
just like by learning more about that
exercising every day like all these
little things that i do that make me
seem regimented in terms of like my diet
and my lifestyle like all of that is
about trying to not be depressed and not
have those suicidal thoughts and like it
helped me to get off the antidepressants
that i was on they were having all these
like adverse side effects and whatnot
that i was like okay it's making so i
don't want to kill myself but i have all
these other things that i now have to
worry about so what can i do to make it
so i don't have to be on antidepressants
and i'm not depressed if that makes
sense yeah it really does
i was curious your thoughts on whether
cs education in particular demands some
of that go-go-go i wonder a little bit
if like the current moment we're in for
the field and i'm sort of saying this
because i imagine a lot of the listeners
to this podcast are watching the people
on twitter they're going to the
conferences they realize that's such an
important moment but i think that may
contribute to the problem you're asking
about and i think it also attracts
people who want to make an impact it is
something i've been reflecting on but
i'm curious your thoughts on it like do
you think there's something it's true
for all of education i think in many
ways but do you think specifically just
the moment we're in for cs education
like is that is there an additional
layer of pressure right now certainly
and especially with all the remote
learning but even before covid was a
thing like programming in particular
software development you could learn a
language and then in five years that
language is obsolete like nobody uses it
anymore so you're just constantly having
to learn new things and just everything
that you knew the week prior okay now
there's this new way to do it or this
better way to do it and on one hand
that's great because it's like if you
want to learn cool tech cs like this is
a field for you i happen to thrive in
that environment but that being said
it can also be overwhelming if you don't
take a break from it so one of the
things that i've been having to remind
myself is like
rest is to the mind as sharpening is to
the axe like you have to take a break
from something and i say this to
somebody who literally taught seven days
a week i teach a full-time gig during
the day i teach part-time at night and
then i teach all day saturday and sunday
like private lessons or drumline and
things like that so having done that and
experienced it i also see the value in
taking a break from it so that when you
come back to it you can have a clear and
focused mind to be able to focus on that
learning and whatnot yeah i think it's
important i don't expect the dream
vision of work that i think maybe my
generation in particular was sold but
sort of just like yo if you love your
work you'll never work a day in your
life and like that's not true like
you're going to work a lot of days of
your life right but there should be some
core excitement and i think if you feel
like it's getting dulled i like the
metaphor of a dull acts like and not
everybody has the freedom to make
choices to step away or recharge or
something like that that definitely
resonates for me i told you i really
appreciated you doing a show like this
because i think a lot of passionate
educators are feeling really deflated
this year yeah one thing i was going to
say about that i actually see it my new
role as well
i think
letting go of how it used to be is so
important right now and i'm actually
being in a new space is giving me the
ability to see that which is that
if you knew how you wanted it to be or
how it used to be
right now hurts because it's not like
that that can be a needless distractor
from how good could we make it given the
realities i don't say that to be naive
i i know there's a lot of challenges but
i do think that there's this extra layer
of kind of like mourning every time
something doesn't look the way it did
pre-covered
and
i want to validate that's real and then
also say if we can put it aside and say
like all right here's the new reality
how good could we make it
i think there's space to rediscover that
motivation and excitement
i don't say this to foot like extra
pressure but if you're aiming to help
people and that's i think what motivates
a lot help them learn help them teach
whatever it happens to be i think the
morning process or the sadness is real
you want to make sure you're listening
to people when they're talking but if
you can kind of bring a more excited
or
a calm version of yourself to whatever
it is you're doing you'll be happier i
think you'll help people more and i
think that does mean letting go a little
bit i've struggled with that so i don't
want to pretend it's easy but it is
something that i think being in a new
space people will tell me it used to be
this way but we can't do it anymore and
the halfway virtual version like you
know wouldn't even be close and i think
if somebody knew i think it'd be pretty
good i'd rather do the halfway virtual
version than nothing at all like so
let's give it a shot yeah i like that it
really resonates with why i went into
education in particular before i decided
to go into it for my degrees and whatnot
i had worked some like office jobs and
even worked as
like a professional stainer and finisher
for closet doors that cost like more
than i paid for my house so like this
like range of experiences where either
was interacting with people
like as a manager at blockbuster or
interacting with closet doors that
wouldn't talk to you so like having that
experience and knowing what it's like to
go in every day and be able to expect
the same thing i didn't like that one of
the things that i loved about the
volunteer teaching that i was doing was
every day it was something new there was
some new
challenge or problem solve or some new
thing that i had to learn and so i guess
if you are able to frame 2020 in that
way then there can be
at least a positive framing of that that
being said there's a lot of things going
on in the world that we still need to
acknowledge that are problematic and
that are troubling a lot of people but
if you are able to at least reframe some
things as a positive then hopefully
that's beneficial for you
i think finding community to help you do
that is really useful too both to say
hey let's do five minutes or we all say
all the things that are really hard and
then here's the candles that were we're
holding on to of the shining lights of
optimism or hope and
yeah i think that finding people who are
willing to do both with you and be
helpful especially if you acknowledge
that they're tied to one another in my
opinion like i'm hopeful because i want
this thing to happen i want to do it
together i want it to be good i'm
saddened because i see all of these
obstacles and challenges and they're
very real right but the other thing it's
not like education used to be this easy
field where everything was working
exactly how everybody wanted it to work
which is not i don't want to be glib i'm
just saying like if you're working side
by side with educators this is a tough
group there's a group that has had to
look in the eye a lot of difficult
situations i'd say by and large when i
get together with educators i'm really i
see the optimism i see that that's why
they're there and i think that being
able to continue to kindle that with one
another possible i think it's possible
to do in communal settings yeah i like
that especially the framing of is we've
always had challenges now it's just
different challenges i think it's true
and i can also fully say that i feel
like a manager said that to me i know
that a little part of me would say oh
but come on like we all know this is
rough like this is way different like it
is worse and that's what i'm saying i
think you need to be able to do both i
think you need to be able to have like
five minutes of like
and then say
and say yeah but this is pretty good we
made it better than it was we're getting
closer it was always tough you know
there might be two steps forward and one
step back so yeah i want to be real i
know it was a difficult year it's a
particularly difficult year for
education but i think that we all serve
ourselves better if we try to find that
communal hope and now an excerpt from
episode 63 which is titled suggestions
and considerations for district-wide
implementation with abi funabiki this is
a good question and i think i am getting
better
at taking vacations and making sure i
take time off or when i finish a big
project make sure i celebrate that a
little bit before just moving on to the
next one
i've actually really liked all of your
suggestions from your guests in these
podcasts i guess one thing
i've talked about with some of our staff
is
how nice all day vacations and full week
vacations are
as opposed to just spreading out time
off
you know in half days or short amounts
of time it's really nice to completely
get away
and focus on other things for a couple
days i think
yeah it's important because like you've
said it to me where it's like oh yeah
like i had to work out over the weekend
so i'm planning on taking like a half
day or two then you have said well it'd
probably be better if you took like a
full day off and then that way your
brain isn't like half committed to
resting for and half committed to
working for most of the day and for
somebody like me because my brain won't
shut off and i'm just constantly
thinking about work it's a lot easier
for me to take a full day or a full week
my friends and family make fun of me i
have a lot of hobbies so that for some
people if it's a good fit could be a
self-care
recommendation what are some example
hobbies that you like to engage in i
personally have found it's really nice
to have like a tactical hobby and then
also a mindless hobby and then also a
hobby where you're learning something it
depends what mood i'm in
depends on my hobbies but my biggest one
is probably just reading you know so i
do
find time to read every day
and i'm not saying i'm good at any of
these things but i enjoy them
so a more tactical one would be painting
i grew up woodworking with my family so
i continue to do some woodworking and
projects in the garage
my learning hobby right now is i'm
learning the mandolin
so taking lessons and i just feel like
it's so good for my brain to be learning
something brand new once a week that
really pushes my brain to think in a new
different way so i love backpacking
mountain biking hiking
when i have time i feel like it's
important to also have you know more
accessible hobbies so that's kind of
where some of these less time-intensive
copies come into play and the following
excerpt from episode 65 is titled see us
for all teachers with melissa raspberry
one thing for sure has been and this you
know may or may not be possible for
teachers when they're on live with their
students but certainly there's some
meetings that
where
i just cut my camera off and just like
i'm here i'm listening i'm focused i
just can't do the camera right now
because there certainly is something
about you know looking at your own image
or just like oh that's interesting
what's that picture back there behind
his head or oh look at the dog is that a
dog in the background you know we get so
distracted by so many things and you
know sometimes having that that like
truly
we did work before
virtually without having to see into
people's homes all day every day some of
it is just cutting the camera off time
and still being able to stay you know
stay focused stay connected but not
having to have the camera on
something i'm trying to do more
is
like i just said like i have to get up
and just change scenery a friend of mine
said this you know it's like going and
looking out the window or sitting
outside and
just like focusing on a bug crawling on
the ground it's like just bringing your
attention to something else that you
know is away from where you are but i'll
be honest to say it it's tough because
you know where's book even though i
worked from home there generally was
something in the evening that was taking
me away from sitting here so whether it
was oh i'm going to go to the grocery
store
or
you know everyone's favorite going to
target or i have a meeting that i have
to drive to or some other thing that i'm
doing that was physically taking me away
from home that's not really happening as
much like oh i have a meeting again on
zoom
or or you know
my grocery store is going to pick it up
because i've ordered it online or it's
being delivered or whatever the case
might be and so i think we really do
have to be intentional with that and a
big big part of it i think is changing
your scenery but again maybe
moving your desk a little bit or going
and looking out a different window as
you're working i think all of those
things help and the following excerpt
from episode 67 is called exploring
computer science with joanna goode i
think again relying on colleagues and
friends and having these conversations
so it doesn't feel like it's a
solo endeavor or such a load because it
can be you know systemic racism is not
the easiest to swallow
and you know as a white person i am very
conscious of how i can
sort of turn off the computer and walk
into the grocery store and have an
experience that is validating all the
systemic racism but validating it from a
place that continues to give me
privilege
and that can be challenging as well
i believe in self-care i like to get
sunshine it's the opposite of the
computing part reminds me of my
commodore 64 and my mother always coming
up and saying go outside and play go
climb a tree and she would kick me out
of the house
and i tried to still do that like okay
i've been at the computer go down and i
like to garden i found that really
restorative for me to feel like my
fingers in the soil and to grow and to
nurture
and also i have always been a swimmer
and i still swim so that gives another
layer to this given that swimming is a
metaphor on being stuck in the shallow
end because swimming is a great form of
self-care and yet i finish this work and
i often go pop to the swimming pool and
i feel great and i have incredibly
awesome exercise
and i look around myself
and i'm surrounded by mostly other white
people swimming at the swimming pool so
it's that self-care but the constant i
mean we live in a society
where to get to my swimming pool
nowadays i have to have a reservation
then you walk through either the women's
locker room or the men's locker room to
get to the pool
so it's almost the things are so clear
how we do this gendering and this racing
and i can't i never shake it because i
think it's who i am i think about these
issues all the time but i try to do the
healthy exercise and the being grounded
in my place and in my community
to remind myself that these ideas and
issues are all connected but we can only
work on it when we take care of
ourselves and we're able to show up and
do the work
all right the excerpt from episode 69 is
titled
csk8 visions by vicky sedgwick i'm
really bad at that i will admit i tend
to be a workaholic
and it's a lot tougher now that work is
at home right so i have to try and
physically say
i'm turning off the computer i am
turning it off and leaving the room i
will admit i'm not good at it i've been
trying to be better the last month or so
because i found myself
just being on edge and stressed out and
i know it's because i'm spending too
much time working pre-covet i love to go
to concerts right but of course i can't
do that now i do attend some online but
again that i'm still in front of a
computer right and it's not the same
experience as going to a live concert so
i don't find it quite as satisfying and
it isn't the escape from being on a
device
right i also really love photography and
i love to go out on photo walks and just
take pictures from unusual perspectives
and stuff like that i have not done that
much lately because it's been 90 plus
degrees out and was very smoky for a
while because of the fires so i haven't
been walking too much but the weather
will turn at some point and then i'll go
out and do more of that so then i also
get you know where i'm moving because i
find i don't move as much as i should
too so and sometimes i'll just you know
read some stupid book that has nothing
to do with anything you know that's
totally an escapist book and then it's
not on a device it's an actual book and
you know i'm not trying to learn
anything from it so yeah i used to be
non-fiction only like i was like well
what's the point if i'm not learning
something new and then i was like okay a
lot of people keep saying they really
value getting into fiction and so i
tried it and i feel like it one it helps
relax me like i do it before i fall
asleep but two it also just like opens
up new perspectives and ways of thinking
and like just helps with creativity
which is a heavy load on my job like i'm
constantly creating new projects and
lessons and things like that so i
personally find a lot of value in that
and then your comments about just
getting up and moving that also relates
to why you saw me yesterday in the
meeting while walking on a treadmill
like i'm tired of sitting in meetings
like for eight hours a day so i need to
make sure i'm moving yeah i like that
i'm working on a desktop right now and i
can't get it high enough to even stand
so i'm trying to work out something
where i can readjust it so i can move my
big monitor up and be able to stand
because just even being able to stand
rather than sit is helpful i find you
know so now we have an excerpt from
episode 71 which is titled considering
leisure and education with roger manti
just like the people at mit for example
who felt the need to
balance out things in their lives
because i spend so much time in front of
a computer and so much time reading and
thinking and writing and everything else
because i'm no longer you know actively
teaching music as music in the way that
i used to but then of late you know
i mean i haven't found people to be
playing my saxophone with when i'm now
picking up the flute and i'm learning
irish flute music you know just for fun
to do that so that's at least one
musical outlet but for the most part you
know i just like to do physically active
things
just to balance out you know all the
reading heavy you know text computer
screen type of things i mean you got to
get outside you got to do something else
so i like to do that i did resume my
squash career a little bit and then of
course everything got shut down again so
i like to do sports you know it's more
fun
our next excerpt is from episode 73 and
it is titled vulnerability reflection
and cs education with amy co
i want to start off just by recognizing
the page and my business and my
productivity it's probably a huge source
of imposter syndrome for a lot of people
because they can't imagine how i get all
of these things done and they're
struggling too so i just want to
acknowledge that i struggle with it too
why i have so many practices for it to
make it better and i've been practicing
the productivity piece of it for a long
time way back when i was starting middle
school back in sixth grade i mentioned
that my mom was a grade school teacher
too
she was the most organized person i knew
she had a lot of paper planners that she
used for everything she was very
organized about her lesson and unit
plans for school and for teaching
and since she was kind of my teacher
role model growing up i wanted a planner
too so really really early on in middle
school i had a planner and to-do list
and a calendar
way overkill
for the time right but it just meant
that i had all of these practices that i
was constantly cultivating and i saw
hers and she would ask me questions
about it like is that working for you do
you want to change anything about it we
can go to this store at the mall and
they can give you a different kind of
to-do list if you want a different one
so the idea that we build practices to
manage our time something i learned
really early on and then just got better
at over time what are ways outside of
the productivity that you
rest or
disconnect from the busyness and being
productive yeah one of them is just the
practice of drawing really sharp lines
around things i work fixed hours i stop
working at a certain time i don't look
at work emails after a certain time i
don't work on the weekends unless i've
traded some weekday time for some
weekend time i'm really strict about how
much time i give my job there are weird
edge cases being you know as a professor
i'm supposed to follow my curiosity so
if i'm curious about something and i
want to go follow it does that work
right is it not work i don't really know
so there's some fuzzy boundaries there
when it comes to research and
scholarship you know but i really do
unplug from work in ways that i think
sometimes other people struggle to do i
got good at that when i was a parent in
graduate school i wanted to have time
for my family and be there with my
family and i just decided that grad
school was going to be a nine-to-five
job so i'd show up in the office at nine
and i'd leave at five and i'd know that
i'd have eight hours to get all of my
classwork and research and other random
service done and it kind of meant that i
didn't spend a lot of time socializing
like a lot of my peers did i just
focused on my family and my research and
then squeezed in social stuff into
travel and other things but it just
meant that i wasn't thinking about work
when i was doing other stuff that was
really a nice way of kind of making
space for other things that mattered in
my life and our next excerpt from
episode 77 is titled healthy boundaries
with siobhan grady if 2020 taught me
anything it was how to have healthy
boundaries and boundaries are not only
for personal they are professional too
and i know that's hard for some people
given whatever job they may have but it
is important that you let people know
when they're overstepping a boundary for
instance if someone's asking you to meet
at a time that you already have book for
something else then you just tell them
no you don't double book yourself i
think a lot of times we're trying to
please other people and in the end we're
hurting ourselves so i would say
implement boundaries
practice self-care
i didn't realize up until last year that
many people don't even
do self-care
self-care is loving yourself
loving yourself might mean an hour in
the morning each day before you get
started where you just meditate or
reflect or whatever that is your time or
in the evening or going walking or
taking a bath
lighting candles whatever it takes that
is a part of self-care and i think that
in order to have more balance we have to
realize when we're actually just doing
too much and that would also require
looking at a planner if all of the hours
in the day are booked up with work
you're not doing that right
we're not robots
we are meant to get sleep and that's
another thing we don't get the proper
rest we're not at our best either when
we're not hydrated getting a proper rest
it starts coming out in other areas so i
would just say for me one thing that i
do is i implement boundaries i practice
self-care loving myself that could be me
going on a daily walk or like i said an
hour in the morning or evening just with
myself just unwinding reflecting and
that's what has helped me tremendously
all right the excerpt from episode 80 is
titled individualized learning without
grades with sophia de jesus so i didn't
avoid the burnout completely as i am
stepping out of the classroom for a bit
but i did take a job that was
educational in nature because i still
want to coach and i still want to teach
and i am an educator and that's who i am
i didn't avoid the burnout as much as i
wish i would have but
i will say that i am lucky in that i
think that the classrooms that i had
built were a lot easier to exist in a
covet world than if i had to redo
everything what i mean by that is yes my
robotics classes are difficult one of my
classes we could do because we have
robots for each child and we kept it at
under 10 because we very generously
revolution robotics donated those robots
so we were able to do that we couldn't
do
all trimesters because between trimester
and one and two for example there was
only one day we couldn't clean
everything get everything ready for the
next group so trimester two we adapted
the class trimester three we're back at
the robots because
three months have gone by and now we can
use the robots again but one of the
things is my seventh and eighth grade
classes we didn't have enough robots to
kind of run that and we have a lot more
students who wanted the class so i can't
have 18 individual robots for example or
something more computational and so we
do some simulations but we also do other
things
i created something where we are always
working around problems so we address
some problems you know and that may be
an ill-defined game based problem or it
can be something else that's easily
adaptable or a lot easier than if i am
married to i have to have my
smart board in front of me a projector
and uh whatever and the materials that i
have in the room or
because i adapt my classes to be very
individualistic
i feel like i didn't make as many
changes or concessions as i would have
had if i was 10 years ago me in that
respect i think i got lucky i think my
students are still having fun they're
still getting in trouble for you doing
stuff for my class in other classes
which i always find fun
it's interesting because when i get a
complaint from a teacher like i caught
your student working on their minecraft
project
i have to respond i'm so sorry i'll talk
to him and inside i'm like yes they were
interested
i am very proud of the fact that my
students continue to work even though
they don't have homework so those kinds
of things i think my classes are easier
to adapt to whatever it is that's thrown
at them because of the way that they are
set up but at the same time it takes a
toll to have to
teach as many classes i'm also helping
with the instructional piece a lot how
do i use technology in the classroom
i've run quite a bit of pd in my school
this year helping with some of the deij
stuff with with our director of the eij
and some of the counseling pieces
with our counselor with our learning
specialist i partner with a lot of
people in the school just to make sure
that we have what we need and i do you
know i've been lucky because again my
administration is super supportive of
what it is that i do
and so we've been sharing as much as
possible with others so that it can
maybe hopefully help them adjust and
adapt in an easier way
but what i want to do this whole year
again
not in a million years not as an
educator
been too much and it's
somebody will inevitably fall through
the cracks because we have students on
screen we have students in the room i
said this recently
you know i got to a point with a student
where they finally shared you know their
passion for anime etc and i had such a
fun conversation with the student and i
was so excited and we were talking a
couple of us teachers were talking and i
said i finally got through to this kid
and we had this amazing conversation and
then i said but yet
i know that the six months it took me to
get here it would have taken me a month
if we were in person right that's the
piece that i miss the most is
i want that connection with my students
i have a really good connection with
some of them because some of my students
are in multiple classes with me so i
have had students who have seen every
single trimester for the last three
years but there's others who are new and
i still don't know them as well right
and that's the part that's difficult as
an educator because our connections to
our students are so important and for me
to know them as individuals in this
setting is hard and the next excerpt
from episode 82 is titled lessons
learned from csta chapters across the
united states with jason bohr i think
for me we talked a little bit before
about you know being workaholics and i
was involved in so many different things
you know i taught english i taught
computer science i coach
some years three different sports you
know it might look like you're spreading
yourself thin but in many ways
was if i was feeling burnt out in my
english classes
computer science classes would give me
back up you know get me excited
particular sport wasn't doing too well
you know we weren't having a great
season was you know the next sport
coming up getting excited about that so
i think you know it's a balance for sure
to find you know how much you can do and
how much what your capacity is
but i feel like that's what helped me
was being involved across multiple
fronts you know and if i wasn't having a
good day here i could still have a good
day over here you know that kind of
approach and our next excerpt from
episode 84 is titled the rise of cs
across the pond with phil bagg burnett
is something that happens for all
teachers and i do massively worry at the
moment in the uk for the head teachers
i have never seen so much workload put
on them by covid regulations and all
sorts of other things i very much fear
for our education system in the next
couple of years because i think we're
going to lose a lot of head teachers and
experienced head teachers are really
valuable and can make a big difference
and i wonder whether we might lose some
teachers in that as well and our
following excerpt from episode 86 is
titled computing education research with
mark guzdail i can't tell you that i
don't get burnt out i will tell you that
it helps that i have a really good
family life you know we take off certain
time every night you know we have dinner
together and just talk we can make sure
that we take off hours and spend time
together i run the things that one picks
up during the pandemic is i've become a
big fan of meditation i try to do
meditation a couple times a day and it
really helps to be mindful and to ground
myself and it's helped a lot with stress
and sleep
so
i actually have fun doing this
i do computing because i enjoy it
my wife and i barbara erickson who's
been my research collaborator on lots of
things we wrote the media computation
books together and did georgia computes
and especially together barbara sees
computing as being a puzzle she loves to
figure out how the algorithm works and
how to make it better and what's going
on here i've never had that puzzle
perspective i've never gotten into
computing as problem solving for me
programming is this cool set of lego
bricks
and i can put them together in all kinds
of different ways to make things
and if it gets hard i sort of like okay
i'm going to do the simplest dumbest
inefficientist way of making this work
when barbara and i were writing the
books i would leave notes in the source
code okay barb i know this is a sucky
algorithm could you please just fix it
and not give me grief about it because
she's much better at that than me so i
get to play with tinker toys and uh
erector sets all day long it's great all
right so the next excerpt from episode
listening to students with dominic
sanders so i enjoy running i'm a part of
black men run there was a little group
that i used to run with weekly again i
just moved here to south carolina so
i'll be doing that shortly i also enjoy
music but then for me what also helps
prevent like burnout i always like think
about my student like i said i have like
pictures of my students on the desk
that's i guess always thinking about
like my why like why i signed up for
this like in the first place i know
there's gonna be like challenging times
and you know like hard trials and
tribulations but i always think about
the student that you know looked up to
me as brother uncle you know dad
whatever it was like what would they
want me to do in this situation think
about the student that was
busting 30 or 40 miles just to have a
seat in my classroom just so they can
you know make a better opportunity for
themselves and their family i always try
to like travel it back to my why
and then that kind of like keeps me
grounded
and then another thing that kind of like
motivates me is like my grandmother she
always talked about like the importance
of education
and then that like she unfortunately had
to stop in like middle school that's
always like my growing piece to like
keep going and remember that like the
people before me like didn't get a
chance to keep going because they had to
so like let me make sure that i'm
creating practices and policies to make
sure that from kindergarten through 12th
grade if this is what you want to do if
this computer science is you know your
path or whatever your path is in this
realm is make sure that i'm creating
spaces and opportunities for you to
succeed and get across the finish line
and the following excerpt from episode
connections with gene rue it's funny
because i think you're assuming i'm not
burned out
no but i mean that's partially a joke
partially not i think this entire time
of pandemic has really burned everyone
out specifically in education everyone's
working so so hard so i feel really
fried i think all of us have been saying
yes to more than we have the capacity to
say yes to and at the same time it's
expected of us to say yes and at the
same time we want to say yes because we
see all that like could be we don't want
to stop because we want to make things
better
and
currently i feel really fried i don't
feel like a vacation would even fully
heal me right and at the risk of
sounding cheesy though i think that like
yeah i think meditation practice helps i
think that yoga practice helps i think
that swimming helps i think that
going for a walk helps like i think
laughter helps with like people who
don't work at all in your field
who are like thinking about different
things
really is important and i am so
appreciative of like my community of
friends and family who
work in different spheres and are
thinking about different things that we
can come together and share and like wow
you know
it helps give me perspective and gives
like breathes new life into what i'm
thinking about we're working on
but yeah i think that the self-care
thing is so huge
and it's like i totally am not doing it
very well
but i'm trying how do you not burn out
it's an ongoing and ever-changing
process kind of like what you're saying
with equity like depending on the
context depending on so many different
factors like it shifts and somebody who
is chronic depression like the tool bag
of tricks that i have that helps me
not feel depressed and when it was
really bad not feel suicidal
each tool
has a different use for a different time
or context or purpose and they don't
always all work
so
like you mentioned with meditation and
yoga yeah those have been fantastic
for most of the time but sometimes
they haven't worked well for me so muay
thai works really well going and hitting
my tie back downstairs like that
something i enjoy doing or playing video
games or playing with my dogs or
rating something whether it's like
artwork or music or whatever like there
are many different things
that i try and do
to assist with that and so i've gone
like as far as like
creating a spreadsheet that would
measure each like 10 minute interval of
the day and i would like write down what
i was doing and then write down how i
felt so i could really try and analyze
what exactly is it that makes me feel
good and what does not you don't have to
go that deep into that it worked well
and i don't do that anymore but
basically just each day now going and
reflecting on what
is something that made me feel good or
like lit my fire and just made me really
excited about something and just keeping
that in basically a journal or a
spreadsheet so when i'm feeling down or
feeling off i can go to that and say
okay here's 100 ideas that have worked
for me in the past
one of them is bound to work for me in
this moment so let me just do a quick
review of it okay i'm going to go try
that thing and then i go and do that
that's really cool wow that spreadsheet
sounds amazing
talk about like
mindfulness
you know
yeah and they have apps for it i just
ended up creating my own my therapist
recommended an app but i didn't have
enough of like the range of emotions
that i wanted to be able to express and
like the kind of activities that i was
engaging in so i wanted to be more
granular and being ocd so i went in and
just kind of basically created my own
like drop down menu for each one of the
cells so
pro tip
that's amazing and thank you also for
being so open about like struggle with
depression because it's like i think
that we need to be
more open and discussing like these
realities i feel like i've been
struggling with anxiety especially
during the pandemic and as i get older
that anxiety increases and so it's kind
of like
finding these ways to
i don't think it ever fully goes away
right like it's not like depression is
suddenly healed one day i don't think
anxiety is suddenly healed one day but
it's like the
how do we come to
see it acknowledge it and then like find
ways to work through it
because i also think about like
the unhealthy practices that i have as a
human being
and that
like add flame to my anxieties how i'm
imprinting those things on my son
like i'm so like that's a huge fear of
mine which creates more anxiety by the
way but like you know just like
how do i not create that like
same kind of patterning my parents are
amazing i love them dearly but for sure
there are probably things that they did
that
you know impact the way that i also
think and behave and i know that there
are things that i'm doing
that he will definitely need therapy for
as well when he's an adult
and so it's just that like
yeah it's
i don't know it's interesting and next
up from episode 92 we have lessons
learned from informal cs education with
grant smith i say no now
there's a balance right and i'm now
in a position where i can't take on
many additional projects
i wouldn't be able to write a 550 page
book right now i wouldn't be able to
make a whole pd course we've even put
our instagram account on hold because of
what i'm doing now in my current
position it's just too much right and
i want to have that balance i don't want
to burn out i want to be able to see my
kids
and so there is a lot to be done
there is so much ahead of us that needs
to be done but we're no good to each
other if we all burn out and we need to
find that balance in our lives and we
need to find out what works for us
i know we've talked about
teachers who end up leaving to go back
into software development right because
the pay is not good enough that's
another form of burnout and we need to
find places that we can feel impactful
effective but also sustainable
so yeah it's all about the sustainable
got to take care of ourselves and the
final interview at least in the last
year from episode 95 is titled exploring
disability and connecting with the arts
with jesse rathgeber the thing that i
probably should have learned earlier on
is that having some way to separate my
work thoughts even if it's not necessary
work life like and it's never going to
be 100 balanced all the time in fact
that's not how balance works right but
it's the notion of being conscious of
having time to unplug and having time to
be fully um plugged in and not
necessarily being halfway during the
summer right now i've made it that
generally most afternoons i don't do a
lot of stuff i'm now on the ramp up
towards school so i'm doing more
afternoon kind of things but i needed
that during the school year i've done a
lot better about unless i have an ex
required thing at seven o'clock
everything shuts off i don't check email
anymore that's it i tell the students
that as well i tell them like hey if
something's due the next day you're
probably not going to email me the night
it's due
and i put it in the syllabi just so that
they all know like and it's all as much
just me trying to model for them that
you need to do this you need to have
some unplugging time i have a couple
activities that i really love doing that
i can get and completely engrossed in
that will force me to not think about
most educational or most of my
professional work number one is
rebuilding guitars and like messing
around with their wiring i have a strat
in the other room that i have rewired
four times in the last week and a half
and it still doesn't play
and i don't know what it is but when i'm
working on it hours pass
and i listen to a podcast and i not once
do i think about other stuff i also i've
gotten really deep back into my vinyl
collection well my vinyl i'm searching
specific things i'm trying to not be a
like a big collector i have tons of
stuff a specific album so i'll come down
here and i'm lucky i have an office
space that's kind of nice and cool arch
and chillers are down here and i just
sit and listen to an album and i do the
whole album
just to kind of take a break those
things have been really really important
and i think the last one is i'm trying
to differentiate like when i'm at work i
do work stuff so like when i'm at my
school office which i can't right now
they're renovating it but like that's
where i get all my school work done so
this space that we're talking i actually
don't do a ton of school work at anymore
because i try to do it at work the
notion of separation having something
else to do and also having kind of a
musical thing to do has been helpful i
mean our dogs are always
like they make you
do something right and then i also have
recently invested in a hammock so when
it's not raining i go out and lay in the
hammock for an hour or so just to kind
of clear my mind yeah that was nice yeah
it has been it's been one of the best
investments i mean the fact that i have
multiple things to share now i think
when you and i met i would not have had
anything that i could have shared that
would have
been my relaxation because i didn't
value relaxation and then i had a mental
breakdown
so you know that's what happens i'm glad
that you asked that because like i try
really hard in my classes anymore even
freshmen because i teach a freshman
intro to college class i really try to
impress upon them that also the notion
of valuing rest and that rest is as
central to getting things done as just
trying to work on it and so like we talk
about like okay you have this essay to
write and how do you break it up okay
well well i've got three hours to write
out right now it's like no no no that's
good but like you might try that but
your brain might not work that way and
some people do but you should test out a
couple different ways of approaching it
because i think having these
conversations is
important it does break some of the
stigma of talking about mental health it
also breaks the stigma of feeling like
you're selfish for taking care of
yourself like i did i often felt like i
should be doing this i should be doing
that i should be doing that but the only
person who thought i should be doing
that was my brain that didn't want me to
relax i don't know about for you but at
least for me especially in the doctoral
program there were so many high
achievers in the program that even if
one person was taking a break i would
not be looking at that break i'd be
looking at the other person who happened
to not be taking a break at that time so
it always just felt like well somebody
out there is working really hard so i
also need to be doing that yep it's
almost that fear of missing out but in
working there's some right now i see so
many people who are like well i just
published this i just published this
like that's great for them that's really
great for them i used to go like oh that
sucks that i didn't do that and maybe
that's one of the mental health secrets
is knowing how to celebrate others
and not to see their successes somehow
tied to your failure all right so here's
a quote that i'd like to review is from
lao tzu so it's people don't get tired
of enjoying and praising one who not
competing as an all the world no
competitor and that is a quote that like
really sits with me and kind of
resonates with what you were saying and
with that that concludes this week's
episode of the csk8 podcast i really
hope these suggestions for preventing
burnout are helpful and again if you
haven't listened to the episode from
last year make sure you check out the
show notes which includes a link to
episode 49 so you can take a listen to
the recommendations from the previous
year thank you so much for listening i
hope you consider sharing and stay tuned
next week for another episode until then
stay safe and i hope you're all having a
wonderful week
Resources/Links Relevant to This Episode
Listen to the full episodes of each excerpt
How to Get Started with Computer Science Education
In this episode I provide a framework for how districts and educators can get started with computer science education for free.
51 Learning at Scale with Kristin Stephens-Martinez
In this interview with Kristin Stephens-Martinez, we discuss learning CS in large classes (e.g., 200+ students), the winding and challenging journey through education and research, recognizing the importance of representation and providing support for underrepresented identities, the benefits of peer instruction, Kristin’s podcast (CS-Ed Podcast), the disconnect between research on education and practice in the classroom, and much more.
53 Situated Language and Learning with Bryan Brown
In this interview Bryan Brown, we discuss the importance of language in education. In particular, we discuss the role of language in teaching and learning, discursive identity, situated language and learning, the importance of representation in education, the role of language on stress, how smartphones and virtual communication platforms (e.g., Zoom) could change learning, and many other topics relevant to CS education and learning.
55 Nicki Washington is Unapologetically Dope
In this interview with Nicki Washington, we discuss the importance of cultural competency, expanding beyond “diversity” by focusing on creating inclusive and equitable environments, learning from people and scholarship outside of the field, lessons learned working with CS educators across the country, lessons learned while teaching during a pandemic, focusing on the humanity in computer science education, and much more. If you haven’t listened to it yet, check out the unpacking scholarship episode that unpacks one of Nicki’s papers.
57 Amplifying VOICES for Social Justice with Lien Diaz
In this interview with Lien Diez, we discuss Lien’s work with Georgia Tech’s Constellations Center for Equity in Computing, what CS educators can do to learn more about and incorporate anti-racist practices, the importance of encouraging and developing both students and teachers as leaders, the shifts and pivots in education as a result of COVID, and much more. After listening to this episode, make sure to check out Lien’s podcast, Voices of Innovative Compassionate Experts in Society (VOICES).
In this week’s interview with Chris Woods (dailySTEM), we discuss the importance of contextualizing STEM through everyday connections, leveraging student interests, blurring boundaries between subject areas, the affordances and constraints of the acronym STEM, Chris’ new book Daily STEM: How to Create a STEM Culture in your Classrooms & Communities, continuing to learn by asking questions, and much more.
61 Designing Curricula at Scale with GT Wrobel
In this interview with GT Wrobel, we discuss the importance of understanding your “why” behind pedagogical approaches and curriculum design, the internal tensions that arise when designing curriculum used by people around the world, the potential for standards and assessment to be a form of oppression, how feedback impacts the evolution of a curriculum, considerations when designing culturally relevant curricula that is used around the world, aligning curriculum development with professional development, the importance of taking a break to prevent burnout, where we hope the field goes in the next few years, and much more.
63 Suggestions and Considerations for District-wide Implementation with Abby Funabiki
In this interview with Abby Funabiki, we discuss the differences between for-profit and nonprofit CS education organizations, the importance and ability for nonprofits to collaborate with others, CS as the new digital divide, how to get started with CS implementation with limited or no extra funding, suggestions and considerations for district-wide implementation, and much more.
65 CS for All Teachers with Melissa Rasberry
In this interview with Melissa Rasberry, we discuss making educational lemonade out of lemons, using technology to collaborate in virtual learning communities, how people are learning differently through online communities, CS for All Teachers, suggestions for using different social media platforms to connect with other educators, and much more.
67 Exploring Computer Science with Joanna Goode
In this interview with Joanna Goode, we discuss corporate influence through neoliberal practices in CS education, reflecting on engaging all students in CS programs, considerations around equity and inclusion in CS education, layers of curriculum design and implementation, discussing and problematizing integration, influences of policy and administrative support (or the lack of) on CS education, Joanna’s experience with developing Exploring Computer Science, and much more.
69 #CSK8 Visions by Vicky Sedgwick
In this interview with Vicky Sedgwick, we discuss Vicky’s journey into CS education, how Vicky’s pedagogy has changed in virtual environments, advice for designing learning experiences in CS, the importance of integrating CS in other subject areas, recommendations for improving equity and inclusion, building online communities in an age where people are questioning the value of social media, and much more.
71 Considering Leisure in Education with Roger Mantie
In this interview with Roger Mantie, we discuss the importance of leisure for self preservation, problematize the single focus of education for workforce readiness, discuss the importance of focusing on happiness and wellbeing, explore discourse in education and around leisure, and much more.
73 Vulnerability, Reflection, and CS Education with Amy Ko
In this interview with Amy Ko, we discuss the importance of mentorship in education, learning what not to do with teaching, the positive results of being vulnerable, understanding and exploring the limitations and consequences of CS, problematizing grades in education, practicing teaching through mental simulations, the importance of engaging in the CS community, and much more.
77 Healthy Boundaries with Siobahn Grady
In this interview with Siobahn Grady, we discuss the importance of self care and healthy boundaries, the impact of education, misconceptions and problematic assumptions people make with HBCUs, misconceptions and misunderstandings of being a professor in CS, lessons learned using machine learning to identify authorship of tweets, exploring the implications of social media and technology with students, the intersections of arts and CS, improving equity and inclusion in computing through action, and much more.
80 Individualized Learning Without Grades with Sofía De Jesús
In this interview with Sofía De Jesús, we discuss Sofía’s book (Applied Computational Thinking with Python: Design algorithmic solutions for complex and challenging real-world problems), the importance of bringing your full self into the classroom, designing for equity and inclusion, working with individuals one-on-one rather than teaching to group averages, problematizing grades in education, collaborating with educators, and much more.
82 Lessons Learned From CSTA Chapters Across the United States with Jason Bohrer
In this interview with Jason Bohrer, we discuss lessons learned coming into computer science education from another subject area, lessons learned working with CSTA chapters across the country (and during a pandemic), how CSTA has impacted the field and continues to evolve over time, how Jason continued to learn about CS without getting burned out, considering equity and inclusion when recruiting for CS education, CSTA’s new CS Teacher Standards, and much more.
84 The Rise of CS Across the Pond with Phil Bagge
In this interview with Phil Bagge, we discuss the rise of CS in UK curricula, the evolution of Phil’s pedagogical approach, how time constraints impact pedagogical approaches, not letting the loudest voices drive instruction, how research informs Phil’s approach for working with teachers new to CS, how to emphasize student agency in teacher professional development, and much more.
86 Computing Education Research with Mark Guzdial
In this interview with Mark Guzdial, we discuss the similarities and differences between constructionism and constructivism, think through when to situate and apply learning, discuss contextualized learning, creating multiple pathways for exploring computer science, problematizing subservient relationships with integrated curricula or courses, task-specific and domain-specific languages, using multiple learning theories through a multiperspectivalist approach, changes to public policy that Mark would make to help out CS educators and the field, and much more.
88 Connecting with and Listening to Students with Dominick Sanders
In this interview with Dominick Sanders, we discuss the importance of connecting with and listening to students, the impact of being a positive role model for kids, considering equity for individuals and across the entire state of South Carolina, what Dominick learned through their experience with Xposure STEM, Dominick’s plan for improving CS in South Carolina, Dominick’s experience with CSTA’s Equity Fellowship, how Dominick continues to learn and grow as a CS educator, thinking through intersectionality in relation to representation, and so much more.
90 Making Meaningful Connections with Jean Ryoo
In this interview with Jean Ryoo, we discuss equity as an evolving idea, what an ideal CS class looks like, collaborating and learning through research-practitioner partnerships (RPPs), the importance of examining our own biases, the importance of community, working through burnout/depression/anxiety, helping students through depression and suicidal ideation, the problems with whitewashing in education, and so much more.
92 Lessons Learned from (In)Formal CS Education with Grant Smith
In this interview with Grant Smith, we discuss the importance of continuing to learn from other educators, what informal and formal learning spaces can learn from each other, how COVID has impacted Grant’s teaching philosophy, our preferences for in-person or virtual professional development and classroom instruction, lessons learned from entrepreneurial adventures in CS education, learning by jumping in and trying new things, heuristic-based learning, and so much more.
95 Exploring (Dis)Ability and Connecting with the Arts with Jesse Rathgeber
In this interview with Jesse Rathgeber, we discuss what educators should know about (dis)ability culture and research, person-first language vs identity-first language, suggestions for combating ableism through anti-ableist practices, how the arts and CS can come together and learn from each other (great for sharing with arts educators who might be interested in CS), and much more.
Find other CS educators and resources by using the #CSK8 hashtag on Twitter